China Law Blog

Dan,
Thanks for the awesome additions to "Hot Water in China?" and some very crucial, timely advice. It is my impression that some foreigners tend to dismiss China's legal systems due to the very fact that they are foreign and thus feel that they can get away with virtually anything. Unfortunately and as I have also witnessed firsthand, this is definitely not the case. The hot water really starts to pour when expats adopt a ru xiang sui su (when in rome, do as the romans do) attitude by participating in kickbacks, bribes, and even your "average night at the karaoke bar/brothel with new Chinese friends"- all things that are best avoided. I hope you move forward with the "Just Say No" post- can't wait to read it.

P.S. Very interested in your input regarding signing of contracts that one cannot read/understand under the gun of the PSB, in the event of a legal snafu.

Take care of your visa stuff early, and be very careful with visa agents.

I had a friend waiting on a visa renewal until the last day of his current visa. The agent kept delaying and delaying, and on the last day took him to customs, gave him back his passport and ran out the door. He was deported that day.

I've only been over on student visas so I haven't had to worry about anything like that, any advice for the right way to extend one's visa while over there? and how to not do it the wrong way?

All I can say is I do not know one expat living/working in China who has not done at least 2 or 3 of these. I almost never carried my passport on me for obvious reasons - it is easy to say that you should carry it, but since the inevitable result will be you losing it to either a pick-pocket or carelessness, leaving it at home is the better option.

Cohabiting is another area in which many expats will find difficult to obey the letter of the law - mainly because it is an outrageously outdated one.

The others, of course, are mere common sense, but it is their application which seems random. I know men who were convicted criminals in the west, and who then carried on a life of crime in China who have remained seemingly immune for years, and people who were perfectly innocent have their visas cancelled over a minor infraction.

All the same, it does little good to complain, the Chinese have their laws and do not give a damn whether you like them or not. The best thing you can do is to avoid anything remotely controversial, and do your best to seem harmless and apologetic in dealing with the authorities.

You should add "Especially if you are Black" to the title of this post. At least in Beijing, the JingCha always treat blacks - from Africa or wherever - with a significantly higher degree of suspicion. A year or two ago I believe the ambassador from Trinidad's son was beaten and thrown in jail because he was in the wrong place - i.e. Sanlitun - at the wrong time. It's not right but it's just the way it is. Also, I'm not trying to start a fight, it's just a fact of life in Beijing that is painfully obvious to the expat community.

Dan,

In my dealings with the PSB (always voluntary and aside from having to report the theft of something, pleasant) they were quite happy to accept a photocopy of my passport. I'd advise against anyone carrying their passport around with them day-to-day. Keep a photocopy in your wallet instead. Unless they are looking to make trouble for you they should be quite willing to accept the photocopy. If they are looking to make trouble for you then having your permit/passport taped to your forehead won't save you.

One more item for the list:

22. Don't put off registering at the local PSB after arriving in China.

The law says you're supposed to do it within 24 hours of arrival (unless you're staying at a hotel, in which case your guest registration usually takes care of it), and I know plenty of people who've put it off for days, weeks, months, forever - and without penalty. But I also know plenty of people who have found that lack of registration provides local gov't with a very convenient excuse to cause all kinds of problems. I've seen it go down that way.

In re to carrying a passport and visa at all times: I carry a photocopy of both in my wallet, and in the couple of cases where I've been asked to show it, those pieces of paper have been more than sufficient. People asking seem to understand the risk of loss/pick-pocket.

Thanks for putting the fear of China back in me ;-)

You need a good lawyer in China. Better you go to a reputable international lawfirm's office in China before you start any business or activities in China. It's worthwhile.

Most especially do not proselytize, organize, demonstrate, or remonstrate which in any way could be interpreted as a challenge or affront to Chinese authority.

Chinese lawyers can't even defend their own interests. It is not reasonable to expect Chinese lawyers to defend yours.

About 10 years ago I had my passport stolen when I was in Beijing. I needed to get a copy of a police report to get a new passport, which was complicated by the fact that, while I was there on a student visa, I had dropped out of school. And I wasn't registered with the PSB at the hotel I was staying at. I had to go to the PSB office several times before they decided to cut me a break, but all it took was me to be friendly, cooperative, and let them know that I was just a poor student who needed them to help me out.

When I was walking out the door with my report I passed a guy who had a Visa issue who was screaming at a cop in really good Beijing hua. Somehow I suspect he didn't do as well as I did.

Very apt post, esp. as things tighten up towards Sept.
I'd add, keep calm, keep smiling and don't get angry.

I don't understand point 3 ("Living or cohabiting illegally") or FOARP's comment that the law is "outrageously outdated". I presume what is meant is "living together in a relationship that includes sex with someone with whom you're not married." What law or regulation does this offend? I ask this of anyone who uses the term 非法同居 but nobody has ever been able to give me an answer.

Don Clarke,

Please see Article 3 of 中华人民共和国婚姻法

Don Clarke wrote: "What law or regulation does this offend? I ask this of anyone who uses the term 非法同居 but nobody has ever been able to give me an answer."

We need to organize a conference of Chinese law experts to better educate foreigners, particularly foreign academics, as to what is required by law of foreigners in China.

I lived in Japan before I lived in China. Although this advice would be inappropriate for businesses, for the standard gaijin, the most important thing to learn was how to apologise really really well. A good apology in Japan goes a very long way. In situations where you might not get permission to do something, acting first and apologising for acting when caught can be very useful.

When dealing with the police in Japan, the standard advice is to apologise regularly, even if you have done nothing wrong. Don't kick-up a fuss, don't be awkward, don't be a pain. Apologise for making work for them and for the hassle that they are going through, even though it is their job, and even if it turns out to be their mistake.

While an apology won't get you as far in China, and you need to be more careful about what you apologise for, I think that this same attitude would be very useful in China - especially as a foreigner.

The first time that I had to do the police registration process myself, rather than through a hotel, I forgot about it for maybe 4 days. My wife (local Chinese) and I went to the local police station, and were very apologetic about forgetting to register. The result was that I was registered smoothly, and didn't have to pay any fine.

Being humble and apologising - it works wonders.

As for breaking the law...

In a small city that I worked in (which I shall not name for reasons which will become clear) the only foreign teachers who had proper Z visas were teaching at the local university - myself included. The local police understood that if they were strict about enforcing proper working visa rules, the private English schools would not be able to hire any foreign teachers.

One of the police officers responsible for foreigners - reasonably high ranking in the city - went to English classes and English corners in one of the private schools. He came along to some of the meals that the foreigners had as a group, and at one such meal the topic of visas came up. One of his remarks was along the lines of "Well, nobody here is working as an English teacher..."

So, everything ran smoothly.

One day, one of the foreigners was late for a class, and rushing along on his scooter when he hit an old lady getting out of a taxi. Her son wasn't happy with the foreigner just paying the hospital bills - he wanted much more compensation. So, the local police visited this foreigner's apartment and took away his passport. When he said "You can't do that", they replied "We know you are working illegally...."

A 1 second lapse of concentration, and your life collapses before your eyes. Best not to be on the wrong side of the law in any foreign country, especially China.

@Betty - When I arrived in China the Jiangsu provincial government gave me a nice little blue booklet detailing all the things forbidden for foreigners to do. It was nice that they had thought to give all foreign visitors (women included) a booklet warning them not to take advantage of local women, take drugs, live in sin or harm national security. Real thoughtful and welcoming.

The law on cohabitation is basically ignored by most of the population, and most foreigners treat it the same way. If the police decide to enforce this law against foreigners then there's little you can really do except be as apologetic and submissive as possible. Chances are that even if they weren't guilty then they would still be vulnerable to it - essentially it is only the kind of thing you can get into trouble for if somebody wants to cause you trouble.

Don Clarke and Kim Jung Il:

"禁止包办、买卖婚姻和其他干涉婚姻自由的行为。禁止借婚姻索取财物。禁止重婚。禁止有配偶者与他人同居。禁止家庭暴力。禁止家庭成员间的虐待和遗弃。"

From http://www.gov.cn/banshi/2005-08/21/content_25037.htm

Translation curtsey of Google translation and my sketch understanding of Chinese characters.

It's a long list of forbidden things:
No selling of marriage, or other actions that impinge on somebody's freedom to marry. And obtaining property through marriage is prohibited - the character 借 is used, which is used for 'lend' but also can be used for 'by means of', so it might mean 'don't obtain property by lending marriage'. My wife's in bed, so I can't check.
Bigamy is prohibited, and if you already married, then you are prohibited from living with someone else. Domestic violence is prohibited, as well as mistreating or abandoning family members.

I think that the main point of difference with the law of 'Western' countries is that in China you need to get a divorce in order to even co-habit with someone else, not just marry someone else. Foreigners would need to check that their Chinese partners really are divorced, not just separated.

I wonder if that law would be applicable to two foreigners who were separated from, but not divorced, their spouses back home, and were living together 'in sin' in China....

All good info for newbies and vets of China above.

I would add that no matter how good you think your language skills are, just don't speak Chinese if you've been taken into the local pai chu suo and make the local PSB call in their "foreign affairs cop" that can act as translator. Also be prepared to lose many hours in wasted time.

Re: FOARP, and others.

I've done some more searching.

"He said that the term [illegal cohabitation] was coined at the end of the 1980s in order to denounce couples living together without marriage, and was more of a moral censure than legal judgment. At that time, when such cohabiting became a surging trend, the society was largely intolerant with such a behavior. The notion of “illegal cohabitation,” according to Mr. Han, does not make much sense in legal terms and China’s Marriage Law does not prohibit man and woman living together without marriage."

http://josieliu.blogspot.com/2007/03/2007-npc-cppcc-journal-day-7.html

I'm not convinced that Chinese law says that simply living together without getting married is illegal. Could someone provide more evidence?

"lawyer Han Deyun, recently pointed out that unmarried cohabitation only became seen as illegal in 1989 and is not actually against the Marriage Law. Since that time, according to Han, people have seen the practice as both immoral and illegal."

http://iftf.typepad.com/virtualchina/2007/03/on_the_bbs_deba.html

So was this change in 1989 enshrined in written law, or was it a change in police action unbacked up by law, or was it a change in the beliefs of the population about what was legal and illegal?

This is very good advice on day to day matters, but the point about corruption and 'under the table' dealings are, in my opinion, pretty much impossible to follow. It overlooks the basic reality that, if they want to get you they will and you are taking a big risk simply setting foot in China. Its probably worth baring this in mind in your dealings as you fervently try and live by the 'rules'. You have to ask the question just how disadvantaged you are being a foreigner in China, and what is the actual point of being there? My conclusion is that China is actually a very closed society and it is impossible to really integrate into it as a foreigner. I am ultra cautious about any business dealings because, as an outsider, you cant protect yourself. I doubt having a Chinese lawyer is much use. A Chinese wife on the other hand might be slightly more helpful.

On a side point, does anyone actually have any statistics on imprisonmnet and deportation of foreigners in China?

My question is only slightly related but do any of the regulars here have a sense for how frequently the U.S. government is taking action on Foreign Corrupt Practices Act investigations?

Thanks

I didn't know what you have to register locally with the PSB within 24 hours after your arrival. Where do you do it like in say Shanghai? Do you go to a local police station and do this?

Re: Neil

Having a Chinese lawyer who you can trust and communicate well with will do you much much more good than having a Chinese wife. Well, on the legal front anyway.

Re: Ted Cruise

That is not a question that I would ask while providing a link to your website offering consulting services. While I'm sure that it isn't, it gives the impression of being motivated by the desire to find loopholes.

Stepping into the realms of idealistic dreams - if every foreign company operating in China refused to engage in any corrupt practices, then there would be a significant change in the practices of Chinese companies. This may be a dream, but isn't something that is worth aiming for?

Not following the rules really opens up foreign businesses to attack. Yes, foreign companies are vulnerable even if they follow the rules- but so are Chinese businesses. But if the company follows the rules, then it is highly unlikely that any of their staff will end up jailed for considerably lengths of time, or even executed. The central Chinese government would step in to intervene in high profile cases which were harming the image of China overseas. If the foreign defendant has clearly broken the laws, then they will not benefit from that intervention. If the foreign defendant has followed the law, then they are likely to benefit from intervention.

While there may be short-term financial benefits from bending the rules, from both an idealistic position and a risk-assessment position, no-one should suggest that bending the rules in China can be considered.

Errrmmmm...... This post isn't aimed at anyone, just at possible suggestions of positions that might be read from posts. Don't take the preaching the wrong way.

Re: Pug_ster

In the two different places I've done it, I had to find out which local police station was responsible for the apartment block I was in. Write down your address, take a translator, and walk into the closest police station to your apartment.

And if you didn't register when you moved in, be really really apologetic about it.

But if you've just been staying in hotels, then they will have done it for you.

Chris,

I always advise clients not to engage in any practices that could even remotely be considered shady. I ask about FCPA because it is another tool to remind people engaged in China trade that they should not try to get creative when it comes to legal compliance.

I would hope than anyone getting advice on how find a loophole in the FCPA would have the sense to fire whoever gives them that advice.

Yes, just go to the local police station to register (申報), just like Chinese visiting must do. If the local police station doesn't handle it they will direct you to the proper place.

Do register. Registry in Shanghai is now entered into a computer at the station, a copy is printed out for you to review and if all is correct you sign two copies which are retained by the police and a third is stamped for you to retain. Upon re-entering the country on the same visa you must bring along that copy to again register.

If you haven't registered understand 1) you've violated the rules and pleading ignorance is no excuse, 2) contrition and courtesy will go a long, long way in resolving your error. But do register. If you think living low-key on the local economy in a Chinese neighborhood somehow goes unnoticed you are dead wrong.

Re: 'illegal cohabitation';
I'd like to second Chris in asking for more info. As far as I know, it has never actually been against the law to live with a sexual partner with whom you are not married, providing neither of you are legally married (and that neither of you are a prostitute). But a lot of people seem to believe that it is against the law, perhaps because of the expression that it is feifa 非法, which I think originally meant that such were relationships were non-legal, as in not recognized by the law, rather than illegal.
From a practical point of view, I'm not sure how anyone could be convicted even if it were illegal, given that it's quite normal for non-sexual partners to share rooms.

"illegal cohabitation":

http://www.chinalawedu.com/news/2004/11/ma2255122459021140026688.html

"Illegal Cohabitation" also includes unmarried persons who live together and, thereby, hold themselves out as being married.

In other words, it's not enough to just "check" that your "partner" is not married.

Long Live THE GREAT LEADER!

从婚姻法及司法解释的各项规定，到人民法院的审判实践活动，我们一贯的作法都是将同居关系限定在双方均未婚的男女未办理结婚登记但以夫妻名义共同生活所形成的关系范围之内。最高人民法院早在1989年11月21日，就公布施行了《关于人民法院审理未办结婚登记而以夫妻名义同居生活案件的若干意见》（以下简称《若干意见》）。

http://www.chinalawedu.com/news/2004/11/ma2255122459021140026688.html

I also notice how this stuff about 'not openly criticising the government' appears to have passed without comment. There are in fact windows for constructive criticism in China - take the 'peking duck' for instance. You have to be careful, but I completely reject the suggestion that you should avoid criticising the government for fear of ending up in jail, as a principle. To do so is cowardly and pathetic.

Neil, foreigners prating away in English about China on a forum like The Peking Duck or similar blogs which audience mostly comprises expats reaffirming each other is not the same as an antagonistic attitude and critical speech in Chinese on a Chinese forum showing up the political shortcomings of the Party to the much wider audience; the internet examples of Chinese citizens, Taiwanese and Hong Kong Chinese censured or imprisoned for such pointed criticism marks the difference. Most especially do the mainland Chinese resent foreigners' criticism in Chinese, but jailing? Hardly. Likewise, I see no evidence that the public’s windows of constructive criticism in English have any effect on the Party or Chinese in general other than to occasionally goad more antagonism.

I guess you have missed an important one in the list for the "Avoiding Chinese Jails", especially for the people who run the blog inside China. That is:

DO NOT PRETEND YOU ARE A CHINESE EXPERT ON EVERYTHING

Some foreigner thought he has lived in China and he knows everything about China. He pretends he is an expert on, say, northwest region of China. He thought he knows the languages (which he doesn’t), he knows the cultures and histories (which he learnt only from the comments made on his blog), He might get some faithful followers on his blog because not everyone in China could do the search on the old achieve of New York Times or copy-and-paste the latest news release from Radio Free Asia (RFA). He jumps at every opportunity to instigate the ethnic hatred, and generates the rumors that picked up and used by RFA couple of days later. He could not explain why his living and travel expanses didn’t match his “foreign expert” income as an English teacher. But he does know to delete all the comments that expose the minority issue in his own country.

It is well known in the intelligence community that the blogging is the most efficient way to collect and spread information. Don’t ever think “they don’t read English, they don’t know what I have put in my blog”. Remember, the most scaring thing is: The population to be able to read English in China will soon be greater than the total population of all the English-speaking countries in this world.

So don’t overestimate yourself if you are a foreigner in a country like China.

If you can’t help yourself but to criticize something in China in order to show off your own superiority, make sure that something didn't happen in your own country. Mostly likely you really don't know too much about the dark side happened in your own country unless you Google it.
Google it before you criticize! This is the age of information highway, no one can be sure he is superior than others.

I have a good deal of personal experience with various police in various places in China.

Take this attitude: China has invited you to dinner and you are China's dinner guest in China's house. Behave accordingly.

The interesting thing about China and legality is, as reflected above, that one quite literally may not be able to exist in China without breaking some laws or regulations. Given that most of us are not perfect, the average person is breaking more laws than required. Most of us probably consider ourselves to be substantially law-abiding citizens of our home countries. So it is a situation of novice law-breakers engaged in illegal activity on a consistent basis.

From my experience, I'd say dealing with Chinese authority doesn't differ greatly from dealing with American (criminal) authority. But what differs is the type of person involved in the activity and his or her perspective on the legitimacy/rationale of the authority.

You have to be careful, but I completely reject the suggestion that you should avoid criticising the government for fear of ending up in jail, as a principle. To do so is cowardly and pathetic.

I don't agree with this assessment from Neil.

I blog about China news in English while living in China. I consciously avoid putting things on there that would antagonize the people in charge of China.

Specifically, I avoid anything to do with the "3 Ts" and that religious sect that tends to ruffle feathers. I also avoid taking direct shots at China or Chinese policy.

That's not to say that I don't talk about mildly controversial stuff. The one-child policy, pollution, and migrant workers and the economic crisis are all are things that I deem OK to talk about. Although even when I discuss these things, I am never flamboyant in my conclusions and/or criticisms.

I suppose my question to this forum is this: Should the western English-language China blogger who stays away from the obvious lightning-rod polarizing issues, yet still delves into some bad news, feel OK about what he or she is doing?

Neil mentioned the Peking Duck. That site goes way beyond what I go into and Richard seems to be doing fine. So I reckon that what I'm doing is fine.

Although the paranoid person inside me knows that my site is at least being monitored for content. And if that content were to start focusing on more controversial things, I reckon something could happen to me.

the police always can find the reason to keep u in the jail .money.....can help and i dont think china has good police .