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Fake China Joint Ventures. Why You Calling Me, I’m Not The Guy!

Posted in Legal News

Four in the mornin and they haul Rubin in,
Take him to the hospital and they bring him upstairs.
The wounded man looks up through his one dyin eye
says, whad you bring him in here for? he aint the guy!

From the Bob Dylan song, “Hurricane.
Not entirely sure why, but just about every week for the last month, I have been getting calls or emails from tiny tech companies telling me they have heard I’m “the guy” for these sorts of difficult technology joint ventures. I have gotten so many of these that I now know pretty much exactly what is going to follow next and here it is:
Caller: I’ve got this great website and it is exactly what China wants/needs. And I’ve been working on developing it with some Chinese tech friends of mine and we want to take it legal so we can start getting VC (venture capital) funding for it. Here’s our plan. Now I know that the old/truly legal/expected/usual way to do this is for me to form my own company and then form a joint venture with my Chinese partners, but I also know that will cost a lot of money. So our plan is for the Chinese company to own the website and then we will have an oral agreement (or a written agreement) that I really own half of it.
Me: Listen, my firm has been contacted at least twenty times after these situations have gone bad and I am aware of at least another twenty times where the same thing has happened, and let me tell you, these arrangements (it is NOT proper to call these joint ventures) virtually always end the same way. They end with the Chinese company booting you out completely and leaving you with no recourse. Protecting foreign companies in legitimate joint ventures is difficult enough, but it is pretty much impossible under the scenario you are describing. We had a guy who paid us a lot of money once for us to do everything we could to try to get “his” multi-million dollar business back. Guess what, we could not even come close to getting it back. Every Chinese lawyer we talked to about suing to get it back told us we had no chance of winning at all. I mean, just listen to the argument we would need to make to the judge:

Your honor, my client knew that China’s laws are very clear on what foreign companies must do to operate legally in China, but he thought these very clear laws should not apply to him because, well because he is an American tech company and he was just too smart/too poor to bother to comply with the very clear laws. So instead, he had this great method for completely circumventing China’s very clear laws. His idea was to not form a company, but rather, have his Chinese friends form the company and he would have a little side deal with that company. Well, that side deal has now gone bad and my client wants you to go against China’s very clear public policy on how foreign business is to be done in China and enforce this unwritten side deal.

What do you think of that argument?
Caller: (long pause) I understand things could go wrong with that kind of arrangement, but would you be willing to draft the contract between me and the Chinese company?
Me: No. I can’t do that. I can’t draft a contract that I know will never work. I just can’t. Give me a call if you ever want to do this legally, in a way where you actually have a chance of profiting from your work down the road.
For more on this, check out “China SMEs, Own If You Want To Own.” To get a feel for how difficult it can be even with a fully legal joint venture, check out this article by Steve Dickinson in China Brief, entitled, “Avoiding Mistakes in Chinese Joint Ventures.” and this Wall Street Journal article I wrote, entitled, “Joint Venture Jeopardy.
UPDATE: In, “Private Equity, Venture Capital and ‘Fake’ China Joint Ventures,” China Hearsay very nicely maps out the way these deals are typically done (using an offshore holding company) and notes that you might have legal recourse in the rare instances where your Chinese partner has “huge assets offshore” in a country in which you can sue and win:

You can tie up the Chinese founders in 100 different contractual knots, but unless those founders have huge assets offshore (real assets, not equity in the holding company) that you can go after in a dispute, they can always tell you to piss off and kick your ass out of the business.

  • http://www.medivisas.com/ uk visa lawyer

    IMHO tech company people seeking VC are some of the most positive people in the world; they don’t want a minor detail like the law getting in the way of their clever plans!
    I predict you’ll keep getting the calls…

  • Anonymous

    Are people looking to you for advice or help?
    Or are just looking for the $?
    Me thinks the $$$.
    But then again.. Hmmmm..

  • James

    I have been reading your blog for some time now.
    But I don’t seem to undertstand how your situation relates to Rubin ‘the hurricane” Carter.
    Do you mean that you are being blamed for a murder?
    Or that you should be crowned something but you will not? ( because you are going to jail)
    Or is it something to do with racism, authority or innocence?
    Sorry I am not sure of your connection here. . .

  • Jack(a Chinese lawyer)

    Oh,why not build a foreign company in Hongkong or Singapore by an American and then compose a joint venture in China with your Chinese friend. That is an easy and not very expensive way. It will not cost you very much to have an offshore company in Hongkong and there will be no income tax on the foreign income of this company.
    This is the normal way of Chinese joint venture.

  • http://twofish.wordpress.com/ Twofish

    There are ways of making these foreign holding companies work and they usually involve making sure that a substantial amount of cash and assets stay outside of China so that if something goes wrong, the foreign investor can take the assets if necessary.
    Something, for example if the foreign holding company is listed on a stock exchange, then if the Chinese company pulls out and breaks the contract, then it can lose access to capital that is being raised on NASDAQ. You pull my license, I pull your license.
    One other thing is that people sometimes get overly excited by complex financial and control structures. If it is complex and created by highly paid lawyers, they it must be bulletproof, right???!!!!
    NO!!!
    The more legally complex something is, the more likely it is that something will go wrong. You have highly paid lawyers, not because something is bulletproof because you are usually skating on very thin ice, and you need a lot of legal talent to create something that has some slight chance of working. A lot of these structures are extremely novel and whether or not they will work in court is something that no one knows, and it will be certainly very expensive to find out.
    However, in the end there is a lot of risk. This is not to say that you shouldn’t do it, sometimes rewards are worth the risk. The flip side is that if you have money that you can lose, then you there is money to be made by skating on thin ice.
    Finally, corporate ventures are like marriages in that no one goes into them expecting things to end badly, but they do because things change. As with any good marriage, corporate partnerships require a lot of good communications about some very sensitive topics.
    If you can stare your partner in the eye, and say “Look, I just don’t trust you that much, but that’s fine because you probably don’t trust me that much” and then have a rational conversation over difficult issues, then that’s a sign of a healthy partnership.

  • http://www.chinalawblog.com/2009/12/do_i_really_need_a_chinese_com.html China Law Blog

    Do I Really Need A Chinese Company?

    I dunno. We recently did a couple of posts on what is required to form a Wholly Foreign Owned Entity (WFOE) in China. In the first of these posts, “How To Start A Business In China — WFOE,” we we set out the four main steps in forming a WFOE. In our s…