China Has No Racial Discrimination

we have to admit this is the chinese excellence which most countries in the world dong’t have.

Legally speaking, China has “No Racial Discrimination.” No law counting Tibetans or Urgurians less then Han. Minorities actually enjoy exempts from certain Chinese laws such as not limited by the one child policy.
The article is really about affirmative actions to level the gap between minorities and Han.
With that said, even if it’s not in the law, it’s in the mind. Don’t expect a non-Han Chinese president (and for that matter, female one) anytime soon.

Terence –
I have found that it sometimes really takes an almost insider’s knowledge to know the internal prejudices of a country. Take Korea for instance. I have been going to Korea maybe 4-6 times a year for 15 years and at the beginning, I made no distinctions among “the Koreans.” It was only when I started becoming friends with people there that I started learning of the huge prejudices between the regions. Not sure if this is really racial discrimination, but skin color does play a role.
Unfortunately, I think there is racial discrimination in every country in the world with different races (whatever that means). Reminds me of the Dr. Seuss book where even the tiniest differences were used as a basis for discriminating. I could not even venture a guess as what country has the least and I am not even sure one could even guess. Perhaps the better question is what country has the least in relation to what it actually has on the ground in terms of differences. Again, I do not even have a guess.

Most of the minorities in China are exempted from one child policy, which is kind of reverse discrimination against the majority. The discrimination against rural migrant workers is a serious social issue getting worse and worse. It may not be called a racial discrimination, but definitely not a good thing in the Harmonic Society.

David (i) — I concur.

David –
Good points.

When I first arrived in China, a chinese co-worker who had lived in the US for a while told me “in China there is no discrimination because everyone knows their place”.
A readily noticable sign of discrimination against dark skinned people is on TV and advertising. All white skinned people, and the skin is made almost paper white. In the movies and TV shows, no dark skinned actors/actresses. And certainly no love scenes involving dark skinned people.
You won’t see the Chinese version of 1950s and 60s Sydney Poitier or Bill Cosby roles for quite some time.

China has no racial discrimination

So, good news: There is no racial discrimination in China. Right…

According to Jonathan Unger, prejudice against minority groups in China is similar in style and prevalence to old South bigotry against African-Americans. Nevertheless, he credits the government for honoring its commitment to ethnic minorities as evidenced by the presence of ethnic minorities in seats of local government. JONATHAN UNGER, THE TRANSFORMATION OF RURAL CHINA 189-192 (2002).
Of course, minority groups have certain advantages (analogous to affirmative action) in that they are exempt from certain financial pressures (still subsidized by the central government–which has cut down on the authoritarian capitalism, i.e., marriage between local government and corporations, seen in many Chinese cities and villages) and are exempted from the one child policy.

nanheyangrouchuan,
What were you watching in your stint in China? Ever seen the show “Three Kingdom?” Zhang Fei is dark skinned and good while Cao Chao is white and evil. For dark skinned love, China has imported quite a bit of Bollywood movies and Indians are sex symbols.
If you were talking about the Chinese girls trying to have white skin, it’s a legacy. White skin used to mean the girls are from rich families and the fair skins signal they never have to work around the house. Chinese girls are less obsessive about white skins then either Taiwanese or Japanese. If you went to Thailand, the girls covering their entire bodies on the beaches are most likely to be from Taiwan or Japan.
Regarding to Cosby, do you want to see a show of Tibetans living happily like Han? I think that’s already on the CCTV.

Oh, by the way, anyone watched the South Park episode “Chef Goes Nanners?” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chef_Goes_Nanners A fitting story for the discussion here.

Well, there may be no legal discrimination, but legislation does not remove it from the population. It almost always happens when I’m with Chinese friends when there is a black person visible, whether on TV or on the street, that they don’t have some negative remark about “hei1 gui3″ which they translate as “black ghost.” It seems their view of blacks is directly related to the movies and shows that are imported portraying them only as thugs, drug dealers, or some type of negative stereotype.
I’ve noticed discrimination against people of minorities with darker skin, both in the hiring process as well as in the education system. Its difficult for me to distinguish whether it is ethnicity alone, or also somehow mixed up with the feelings of the more educated city dwellers with the poorer farmers from the countryside, usually with some negative classification of “uneducated” or “country-bumpkin” attached to their comment, but almost always in reference to a person of darker skin, whether from ethnicity or the tanned skin of a laborer.
I’ve noticed discrimination against people from different regions, particularly from the NE peoples about those in the SE, usually tied to their “impurity” of accent or pronunciation of “standard” Mandarin. For those “outside” Chinese, who immigrated to Malaysia, Indonesia, or the west, I’ve noticed a great deal of discrimination by mainlanders. As to the Japanese, well the comments I’ve heard are rather hair-raising sometimes. (Yes, I know the history, and the secondary history books.)
What is missing were the follow-up questions by the reporter (so frequently missing in these “news” interviews) about discrimination by the population against not only ethnic minorities, but based on education, economics, social class, and geography, as well as toward other non-Chinese races.
I also agree, there is a totally different understanding of prejudice in China. Whether it’s the number of eye-folds or the whiteness of the skin, or the educational levels, or the accents, or countless other non-relevant characteristics, China is not immune to discrimination. The only thing that I’ve consistently been bothered by across China is the widespread stereotyping for non-Chinese races, both good and bad.
Racism exists in every country, and the neutrality of the law has not changed that one bit, in China or anywhere else.

nanheyangrouchuan –
You are right regarding the preference for light skin in China.

flotsam –
Why of course?

jk –
And everybody I know in China outside Shanghai hates the Shanghaiese.

meiguo –
Of course. Yet at the same time, laws are absolutely essential. Laws cannot instantly change a populace, but they can let the populace know what will be considered right and what will be considered wrong. Without a doubt, the Civil Rights Act in the United States has had a tremendous impact on reducing racism here. To China’s credit, it has the laws. Now, it just needs to change the minds.

nanheyangrouchuan –
And that’s the point. There is, unfortunately, enough racism to go around, virtually everywhere in the world, and certainly in the U.S. But its like any problem in that the first step toward a solution is facing up to the problem. I like good news as much as anyone, but articles like this can be harmful.

Well, Iam a Chinese lawyer working in the one of the top 3 lawfirms in southern China. Our law firm is located in Guangzhou. In this city, there is an commercial area in which many black people are living. You can see them everywhere.Most of them are doing trading bussiness in China. As far as I know, they are living a happy life in Guangzhou.And some of them even have their whole families move to Guangzhou.You can often see lovely little black babies on the street.In the building where my office is located, many black people are go in and out everyday as others. I don’t hear any unfriendly conversations on them.

atthecoalface –
Thanks for checking back in on this.

I wasn’t going to comment here, as others have said what I would have said, but it seems that someone else who has my (very common) name has said something completely unrepresentative of what I would say.
Of course there are many people in China with racist predjudices. I worked in a Chinese company (English school) in Xinjiang which was extremely unwilling to hire Uighurs, which I think is quite normal. One of the part-time Uighur teachers they did have was once asked by her students (children) where she came from. She said she was Uighur and their response was “but you don’t smell.”
And fellow name-mate Joe, even the Chinese media had a piece about racism against black people in Guangzhou a few months ago. (On QQ -sorry I don’t have the link, but if you’re interested you could just do a search)

Condi Rice really stirs up the racist feelings when she comes to China. The blogs are full of comments containing “monkey”, “gorilla” and “coal”.
And you’ve got to love the Chinese name for Africa…?? which means “lawless land”.
And those black people in Guangzhou only get subtle insults hurled at them, just wait until some young black man and a cute local girl decides to hang out together.

Thank goodness for that! What great news!
There I was starting to think that China was a proto-fascist country, with an alarming increase in unreasoned, off-balance and crazy racism and prejudice which is justified on the basis of nationalism, and is in danger of going out of control.
After this news, all Japanese people can go about their business in China without any fear of unfriendliness or bad feeling, Xinjiang people will no longer be accused of stealing (incidentally, the only people who have never cheated me in China are Uighurs, and that includes Han Chinese, Europeans, and Americans), and foreign teachers will be recruited on the basis of their English speaking ability and teaching experience, not their caucasian faces (someone should tell the school where the russian guy I know works – he told them he was a native speaker, and sadly no-one there knows any better. But he has a white face, so everything is fine.)
I can’t imagine what a celebration there will be when the news reaches Tibet! Fantastic!
Just shows how wrong you can be.

the original joe –
Thanks for checking in and for your does of reality.

zzyzx –
It’s no secret.

Gordon Bennett –
Is life just grand?

well, haha, I am happened to be a Sichuan people.Actually, we do have a word “heigui”.The last generation may say this word sometimes.But in our generation,I hardly heard people say”heigui”. For we have been taught that “heigui”is an unpolite word since we are very young.
Reply to The original Joe, what I said is what i have seen in China. I couldn’t deny that there might be racial discrimination in China.But I can say without any hesitation that USA have more racial discrimination than us. I just got a news a few months ago that a black young man just was killed by polices in a city in USA before his wedding night. Simply because he drived a car after drinking some beer.The police shot him with more than fifty bulletes.Well, was he a monster or something? If he is a white man,how about the behavior of the policeman? Could you answer me, another Joe?

hahaha. i just read through all of the 48 comments and i can say that while a lot of people are accurate in their accounts of China, only a handful is actually addressing what the Xinhua article was talking about.
There is no doubt that China has discrimination. Every culture does. However, China’s discrimination (remember, this article is talking about the Chinese population itself ,within it’s own people, not with westerners…because Chinese people are probably the MOST racist people when dealing with foreigners) is based on physical, socio-economic, educational (kinda socio-economic) and regional attributes.
The beauty of Chinese people is that it is incredibly difficult to tell by skin color what race a person is. For example, my aunt is Manchu. A 2nd uncle of mine is Mongol. I didn’t know that or would have ever guessed it until someone told me specifically.
Many people have qualified their statement that since Chinese people like fair skin, and most minorities in China have dark skin, this is basically racial discrimination. I can tell you that I probably have the one of the darkest skin out of any Chinese in Shenzhen, and I’m made fun of for it from my colleagues, family and friends. However, since I’m tall, i get acclaim for that. No one knows what ethnic group i am.

David –
nh — can you give us cites?
Your point about institutionalization of racism is a good one and that is why the laws matter.

I was at a ski resort in Dalian doing a spot of snowboarding in Febuary. Anyhow as I was going up a ski lift with a small Chinese kid beside me. The kids english was incredible but I was more amazed at one of the questions he asked me.
Are there many black people where I am from? You know – black people – niggers!!”
My jaw dropped, this was at the end of the ride and I didn’t have a chance to reply. This was coming from a kid aged 8 or 9. Personally I blame the parents.

I’m pretty sure that he didn’t know the meaning of the words, their true meaning at least however I’m sure that he knew it was a bad word. I just wonder if he would have repeated it in front of his parents. If I was in his place and said anything remotely similar in front of my parents I don’t think I would have been able to sit down for at least a month.
People back home would have blamed MTV for this language, since when did MTV play music videos anyway?

Amban –
That is a pretty harsh quote. Pretty old though too.

“I just got a news a few months ago that a black young man just was killed by polices in a city in USA before his wedding night. Simply because he drived a car after drinking some beer.The police shot him with more than fifty bulletes.Well, was he a monster or something? If he is a white man,how about the behavior of the policeman? Could you answer me, another Joe?”
Black cops committing violence is a more prevelant thing in US cities than with white cops these days. A couple of rap artists wrote songs about this between 1985 and 1995 (KRS-1′s “Black Cop” comes to mind).
And those cops got punished for shooting that guy.

Amban,
Thanks for digging out the quote. Kang Youwei was a reformist inspired by Meiji Restoration in Japan. He was an advocate of aggressive westernization. I think he could have been influenced by the writer I quoted in his tour of America. The quote is from “Note on the State of Virginia” by Thomas Jefferson under the the “Law” section.
Kang was turned from a reformist to a political outcast. His reputation got equally trashed in both ROC and RPC for his political orientation toward the monarchy.
I’d be curious for anyone to find other possible origin of Kang’s attitude toward black from Chinese literatures.

David Li:
The question of to what extent Chinese ideas about race and ethnicity have been influenced by Western notions is extremely interesting. I do recommend you look at some of Frank Dikotter’s work in this area.
But how relevant is it here? If racist Chinese people were influenced by Americans, Austrians or Manchus, does that make them any less racist?

David Li asked “I’d challenge anyone to dig out a quote by any Chinese writer in the scale of racism expressed in this quote.”
So here it is:
“Kang Youwei (1858-1927), one of the most acclaimed philosophers of the late 19th century, judged that Africans, ‘with their iron faces, silver teeth, slanting jaws like a pig, front view like an ox, full breasts and long hair, their hands and feet dark black, stupid like sheep or swine,’ should be whitened by intermarriage, although he feared that no refined white girl would ever agree to mate with a ‘monstrously ugly black.’ Whites and yellows who married blacks as a contribution to the purification of mankind should therefore be awarded a medal with the inscription ‘Improver of the Race,’ whereas ‘browns or blacks whose characteristics are too bad, whose physical appearance is too ugly or who carry a disease should be given a sterilizing medication to stop the perpetuation of their race.’”
Quoted from Frank Diktter, “Racial Identities in China: Context and Meaning,” _The China Quarterly_, No. 138. (Jun., 1994), pp. 405.

David Li,
You wondered where people had referred to Condi with the Chinese equivalent of the “n”-word. Here is one example. Pretty disturbing stuff:
http://my.cnd.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=36001&forum=6

Amban –
Interesting quote.

The other Joe –
I agree.

“I would have to say that any discussion about race with Americans creates a level of fervor. Just look at how many comments there are here…”
The US has quite a caustic mix of ethnicities and religions. Everyone makes a big deal out of a defaced mosque, temple or church now, but that is nothing compared to 100-200 years ago. The US was founded as an english colony but settled and built by ethnic groups who had nothing but hatred and suspicion towards each other. Big race and religious riots were common and the police in the big cities were often first generation native born citizens in their families, so LOE felt the tug of ethnic and religious loyalty as well.
But those silly villagers eventually had to work things out, especially when their kids and grandkids were marrying the people they hated.
The race riots of the 1960s were nothing in comparison, but thanks to mass media were highly visible around the world.
Ethnic relations has been a constant front burner subject in this country for well over 100 years and will continue as the newest wave pours in from Africa, Asia, Latin America and the Middle East. They’ll all have to learn to get along AND to fit in. They will have to bury their silly village hatreds and superstitions just like the European immigrants had to.

On a lighter note, enjoy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63bWYFGBTuE

David/nh/others –
I think you are right about the need to distinguish between institutional racism and racist incidents. I also agree that history is important in determining the “stickiness” of present day racism. Mr. Li raises an interesting question as to whether racism has less sting if it is directed at all others, not just some others.
I wish my Chinese history were better so I could speak to that here.

Amban –
I am strongly with you. Comments like that do NOT come with the territory of being Secretary of State. Those are racial comments, plain and simple.

Amban and Dan,
I have the same disgusting feeling as you reading the words. However, we really have to put this in a context so we don’t overreact to this.
First, this is Sina chat room and it’s famous for verbal assault and personal attacks. Sina has been known to flame the fire in the chat room to keep up the traffic. If you read across the chat room transcript, the level of nastiness of that discussion is about normal for Sina. Foreigner politicians (well, not the RPC officials for Sina has aggressive censoring practice), movie stars, successful politicians, writers and celebrities have been attacked this way on the Sina. It’s nasty but all I am trying to say here is Rice was not singled out for such nasty attack because she’s black woman. It’s not like those on Sina chat room spare others. There is a big difference between everybody get flamed the same way and just her. Sina chat room is the slum of Chinese Internet and what do you expect from a street fight in a slum?
Second, there is really no historical baggage for Chinese not to use nasty terms on black (and for that matter white, brown and yellow). Black has not been singled out for discrimination here and for that matter, any minority in China. Calling a white man pig sounds just about as bad as calling a black woman monkey. There are no historical meaning to those terms in China. Try to explain to a Chinese why Michael Richards’ use of the N word or Mel Gibson’s comment on Jew got them in trouble while Chris Rocks are making a bundle making fun of white people.
Third, the street fight nature of the Sina char room discussion is to drag celebrities in focus down to their level using whatever mean available. It gets nasty but that’s how it is in a street fight.

Amban,
For your comments on institutional racism, the first question to ask is whether or not anyone has the right to do so regardless to their race or country of origin under the law.
There is a difference between everyone get screwed the same amount or me getting screwed more because of my race, country of origin or whatever. Well, excluding me being an ass and deserve it.
Also, your examples are not easy to prove in court. Not expert but, even in the US, those cases are hard to fight. How easy is it to prove those cases in the US court? A little helps from the lawyers here. ;)

David Li,
You make it sound like the attacks on Condi are just something normal that only happens on Sina and nowhere else. I have given you a lot of evidence of racism in China, but nothing seems to be good enough. Did you read the article I posted? It is very easy to dismiss racism when you are not the target! You should take a walk with a black friend down the streets of Beijing and observe what happens around you. I have done it a couple of times, and it is shocking what you see and hear. As a person with European looks, I do get my fair share of abuse too, but it is nothing compared to what Africans have to put up with. I have visited China regularly since the late 80s and this is something that has not changed.
I think it is shocking that there is almost no debate about this in China and there is a great risk that the Beijing Olympics will be ruined by racist incidents. A number of sports riots recently have given us a taste of what it might look like. Perhaps it is only when the Chinese government realizes that the reputation of China is at stake that something will be done about it, but it is too late to do anything about for next year.

The other Joe,
It’s interesting that your bring up Uighurs. The autonomous region laws have exempt them from certain restriction of Chinese laws. The most important one is the right to own lands. Most of cotton farms in Xinjiang are owned by Uighurs and they are importing Han labors from Sichun and other regions to pick cottons because they can’t find enough Uighurs wanting to do the jobs.
I agree that good studies into the issues would be great. I think I saw a couple published by People’s university professors in the bookstores. However, I think it’s hard to do at this point because race isn’t the only dividing line. There are also wealth and religions.
You mentioned “get rid of it.” What exactly is the “it?” we are talking about here? There are no discriminatory stature, no organized racist group, and no hideous hate crime. How dangerous for a Han to walk into a Uighur village or a Uighur into a Han?
All we have now is some random incidents and very annoying usage of racial slums. But do we really want to see China pushing more policies in the restriction of expression and speeches?

David Li says that there is “no discriminatory stature, no organized racist group, and no hideous hate crime.” Wow, I guess that the Uighurs must be very happy then.
Well, I quote from an UNPO report
“More than 90 percent of administrative and economic bodies in Eastern Turkestan are occupied by non-Uyghurs.”
“Whereas the Chinese authorities are creating new jobs in Eastern Turkestan, these jobs are largely reserved for Chinese settlers.”
“Official educational policy entails that, at present, almost 70 percent of schools in Eastern Turkestan have classes taught in Chinese. It is further estimated that 60 percent of the adult population in Eastern Turkestan is illiterate. Very few Uyghur students who graduate from higher educational institutions are able to find jobs apposite to their qualifications.”
“Despite Eastern Turkestan’s natural wealth, the Uyghurs live below the poverty line. According to a report released by the “Xinjiang Provincial Government” on 28 November 2004, the average income of the Chinese in Eastern Turkestan is 3.6 times higher that that of Uyghurs.”
To me this sounds more like a colony than an autonomous region. Here is some more reading:
http://hrw.org/english/docs/2005/04/11/china10447.htm
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/55/802.html

The other Joe
I think it might be difficult.

Amban,
I know racial slums are common in China, targeting at people from different regions and minority groups. It annoys me, especially when I first moved here from L.A. where I spent a decade living through L.A. riot and O.J. trial. I do understand what racial tension can lead to. However, I was trying to put them into a context so we can analysis the situation more objectively. Simply applying a US standard would certainly make it look much worse then it actually is.
I do read the article you mentioned. It starts with discrimination against black and ends with author’s personal experience (Asian looking but no Chinese language skill). You mentioned your experience of abuse with your European look (white, blonde?). I can also offer my own stories in Beijing which can be interrupted as mistreatment of a Taiwanese who speaks Mandarin with accent.
Is there a discrimination here? Yes. Is it targeting at specific groups? Not really. Is there an insensitivity with racial slums? Yes. Is it just rudeness or hatred and fear? Beijingren are known to be cooky and look down on anyone outside of Beijing. There is a Chinese saying for it: “Living at the foot of the Emperor” which make them feel superior to anyone else. It’s annoying but harmless.
On the other hand, I was in a bar in Changsha, Hunan with a couple Dens. We were with a black student in Hunan Univ from Kenya. Several locals in the bar were buying all of us drinks for no particular reason other then to welcome us.

The other Joe,
I agree that equal opportunities are important but that can’t be done overnight and by government policy. There are many researches in this area showing that names along would create unequal status. Roland Fryer of Harvard has published some pretty interesting papers on the subject of black in the US.
If Fryer’s study is to be believed, the best suggestion for Uighurs is to act Han, adapting a Han name and start speaking good Mandarin to avoid the problems with employment for the short term.
I don’t think Uighurs have problem with school headmasters for the college entrance as under the current system, they are treated preferentially. However, this does turn against them on the CV for a job. Being both Peking U. graduates, Uighurs would suffer from adverse adverting effect of the preferential treatment they received in college entrance because people would tend to assume they are in Peking U. because of their race, not their talent.
It’s a complex problems without simple solutions. All we really can do is to ensure the discrimination isn’t manifested in policy and statures. Taking it out of people’s mind will take a long time.

It’s interesting that he says “There is no discrimination”. There might not be direct discrimination, i.e. “I hate XYZ minority group”, but when I had my camera pickpocketed all my Chinese friends immediately said “it was a XinJiang kid. No second thoughts, no questions. Automatic assumption.

David Li,
Firstly, you write: “If Fryer’s study is to be believed, the best suggestion for Uighurs is to act Han, adapting a Han name and start speaking good Mandarin to avoid the problems with employment for the short term.”
I can’t resist firstly asking how you think most Han people would feel if they were told that to get a job in China they would have to act Japanese. But what you say is probably true. It’s certainly the case that nobody would get anywhere in New Zealand speaking bad English, even though the Maori is also an official language. But this kind of assimilation process is not a short, easy and painless one. Apart from the fact that some people feel proud of their culture, cultural assimilation to another group can cause all sorts of social problems. To give just one example, I once read a excellent piece about problems of Maori families during the 1930s -1950s raising their kids to be ‘pakeha’ (white) but really knowing exactly how to do that, or what it meant to be pakeha because the parents themselves were from a completely different cultural world. It created a generation of kids who grew up disconnected from their parent’s generation, without a sense of belonging, which led to communities without focus or leadership. It’s not difficult to understand that under such conditions crime, alcoholism and violence all increased. What’s this got to do with you, I and the Uighurs?
I think Chinese could draw on the negative experiences of European colonial history, and be aware that these kinds of problems ARE likely to arise in China’s minority populations. If more people understood what I have just outlined, perhaps crude stereotypes which portray Uighurs as dirty, uncultured and criminal might be less common.
I more or less agree when you say this: “The discrimination of poor is a more serious problems in China and these are institutionalized”. But one difference I see is that discrimination against people from the countryside is vigourously reported among certain sections of the Chinese media. I’ve never read anything about racism. If you could direct me to any articles or reports I would be very grateful.
Again it’s the lack of awareness that disturbs me.

Amban –
I agree with you that “The fact that Chinese also are discriminated against does in no way vititate the fact that foreigners and ethnic minorities suffer discrimination too – in fact this is part and parcel of the same problem. Is racism worse in China than in other countries? Hard to tell. But I think it is worrisome that there is little or no discussion about this in China.”
In fact, that was why I did this post in the first place. Not to go after China for racism. Not to argue that any country has this issue covered. Rather, it was to go after the idea that there is no racism in China. Hate to bring in a corny line here, but truly, the first step towards resolving a problem is to admit there is one.

Stephen –
I completely believe you and this is exactly the kind of racism that is being denied and should be discussed.

David –
I disagree. I agree that minorities must go out and make money like everyone else and that hard work can overcome many things, including, much of the time, racism. But, just making money is not enough to end racism and one can be rich and still feel the pain of racism quite strongly.
Talk to a well off African American parent with a 16 year old boy in the United States and ask them if they think their money insulates them from racism.
I am as big on bootstraps as you are, but that solves only one part of the problem.

David Li,
For all the talk about historical legacies, it seems that you forget your own argument when it is most relevant. The difference between the historcial legacies of African Americans and Chinese Americans is huge. The former were brought to the US against their will and the latter are mostly voluntary immigrants.

Is China racist?
Name ten rich & famous or high placed gov’t officials (as in provincial governor or higher, no “minority representatives”) who are non-Han in China today.

David Li,
“There are generations of bananas (yellow outside and white inside) but there is very little outcries of losing culture heritages in the community. There are very little problems with crime and poverty in the Asian American community.”
Asian American’s (as far as I know) have done very well. But you can’t really compare being an immigrant to being a native. Immigrants should expect to have to change their culture. They should expect that when they go to school they won’t speak ‘their’ language or learn ‘their’ history. They should expect to become those ‘banana people’. People living in their own native place don’t expect (or necessarily want) any of these things.
Also how active are they in politics? How active are they in cultural fields outside a relatively narrowly defined “Asian-American” cultural field? The answer in New Zealand is “not very”. So despite all their success, there are still substantial prejudices and barriers. So a minority group can’t just “get on its bike”, get itself a job and work its way to success. Of course maybe Asian New Zealanders don’t really care about politics (although one wonders why not). If so, fine, but it we can’t expect Uighurs not to care about politics in their own native place.
Also the Chinese minority population is closer to 10%. A report here suggests that by 2050 one third of the total population will come from a minority.

David Li,
Thanks for the link to this article http://social.ruc.edu.cn/show/detail.php?id=171, from the Centre for Studies of Sociological Theory at Renmin University. After I got past the inevitable first two paragraphs about the dangers of Tibetan and Uighur terrorism and separatism, I found the article to be well written and in agreement with my own opinions. I would have liked more examples and a bit more clarity in parts, but the writer largely confirms what I and others have been saying: i.e. that, contrary to the original Xinhua article Dan read, China does have serious problems with ethnic conflict. The article points out that clearly that discrimination and racism has something to do with this. For the benefit of those who don’t have time to read it, I wrote some quotes in English below.
None of this makes me think China is worse than other countries. These are very common and difficult to solve problems. One thing that does disturb me, again, is that while everyone in China knows about the Uighur terrorists, very few people seem to be aware of other aspects of ethnic tension, especially discrimination.
Issues of employment, cadre recruitment, education and language use can often cause conflict between ethnic groups.
Research has proven that the relative disparity in economic development between different ethnic groups is an important factor threatening political stability.
Changes in relative economic power [between different ethnic groups] also result in corresponding shifts in political power.
Some enterprises and locations, in order to further their own interests, undertake actions that are harmful to the interests of minority regions, causing ethnic relations to deteriorate.
Disputes over economic issues frequently occur between national enterprises local ethnic groups. [The writer gives an example of one such dispute in Hainan.] Furthermore, whether or not local minority ethnic groups are taken into consideration in questions of land-use, resource extraction, employment and cadre recruitment, ecological protection and the distribution of profits and products directly affects the relationships between ethnic groups and can easily cause ethnic conflict.
Most startling to me, the writer also says that publications, cultural products and recordings that are insulting to the feelings of minority ethnic groups and religious groups have been increasing in recent years. The writer gives an example of something blatantly offensive to Muslims that was published in Baoding in 1998. It is difficult to say that the media is deliberately attempting to create disturbances, but some inappropriate content definitely exists.
The reasons for the ethnic disparity, conflict and violence include: recourse distribution; feelings of injustice and discrimination caused by economic and political competition; and reactions to prejudice and belittling identifications.
Our country’s ethnic conflicts are increasing.
Finally: One important reason for conflicts and disputes is that a very large number of cadres and ordinary people lack knowledge of other ethnic groups.

Amban,
Chinese immigration to US started in gold rush, mostly poor peasant males lured by the dream of gold. However, few found gold and some scholars argued that Chinese immigrants at this post civil war period move in to release some labor shortage created by the freeing slaves. At one point, Chinese were 25% of workforce in California doing jobs even freed slaves don’t want. The worrying of Chinese immigrants had US Congress created the first racial discriminating legislation “Chinese Exclusion Act” in 1880 lasting until 1950. McCarthy’s purge of communists also targeted at Chinese Americans. Qian Xuesen the father of Chinese aerospace was deported to China even though he was an US citizen, professor Cal Tech and a US army officer.
The Chinese immigration to the US wasn’t smooth and subjected to just about the same discriminations all minority groups suffered. But there are few Chinese Americans talking about these.

David –
I do not think it is overemphasized. I think, if anything, it is not discussed enough.
The reality is that if you are Black in America, you will face subtle racism just about every day. I have a black male friend with a nice car who every once in a while gets stopped by the police at night for “driving while black.” I have never once been stopped.
Teachers expect less of their black students. Sometimes this is concious, sometimes it is not, but I have no doubt it is often there.
Watch how a store monitors a 16 year old black male compared to a 16 year old white male. It is this sort of thing to which I was referring when I told you to talk to wealthy blacks with a 16 year old kid.
And what about Blacks on TV. Until only around ten years ago, Blacks were either pimps, drug dealers, or absolutely perfect human beings. God forbid that any of them should actually be like 99% of the Blacks I have known, i.e., with both good and bad traits. Homicide: Life on the Streets was the first TV show I remember that portrayed Blacks as human beings. Again, what if your kid were Black?
Now I am actually opposed to Affirmative Action based on race (for reasons I will not bother going into here), but is it fair for Whites to have “legacy” at so many of the top colleges and Universities, when that is so much more unlikely for Blacks, whose grandparents were pretty much blocked?
I love Chris Rock (Has he been getting soft of late? Do all successful comedians eventually lose their edge?) and I love how he sticks it to people, including Blacks, but I think it wrong to base one’s views on race in America on Chris Rock.
I would urge you to talk with Blacks YOU respect on these issues and really listen. I think you will be shocked that the really successful Black guy you know who absolutely never talks about racism will have countless stories of racism to tell you.
I had a White friend from law school who was married to a Black. My friend took a summer job at a prominent huge international firm and then found himself one of very few people from the summer program who did not get a permanent offer. None of us could understand how this had happened to him because he is the last person who would ever offend anyone and that was pretty much what one had to do not to get an offer. Maybe five years later, one of my friends told me he had been at a party with a lawyer from this firm and they started talking about their law schools and when this lawyer realized that my friend had been a friend of my friend who had not gotten the offer, he apologized. He apologized because he said that my friend had not gotten the offer because a very senior partner had the firm had made very clear that so long as he was at the firm they would never hire a lawyer who was part of a mixed marriage. I will not reveal the name of the firm, but just so people don’t try to pigeonhole this incident, I will say that it is NOT based in the South.
I am not calling for affirmative action. I am not calling for government intervention. I am just trying to point out that skepticism is appropriate when a non-Black starts talking about how Blacks should see things. I am not saying we Whites need to keep our mouths shut on these issues because I believe the exact opposite on that, but I am saying that it is very difficult for us to understand. I don’t claim to and I am very skeptical of those who do. You seem to make that claim and so I have to wonder on what basis you can feel you know so much about this.

Ok, hanfei got me. To a point, all of them are light skinned.
“The worrying of Chinese immigrants had US Congress created the first racial discriminating legislation “Chinese Exclusion Act” in 1880 lasting until 1950″
That act has a couple of roots, one is racist, another root is that railroad bosses would send ethnic groups they didn’t like into tunnels to plant TNT. The casualty rate was pretty high and Chinese laborers among those groups.
“McCarthy’s purge of communists also targeted at Chinese Americans.”
McCarthy targeted everyone and I have first hand knowledge of baby-boomers who studied eastern european culture and languages out of interest and were visited by the FBI. There are a few famous directors in Hollywood today who actually operate under pen names because they are still on “the black list”. McCarthy gave the US its “cultural revolution” because he was otherwise an unnoteworthy, bland name in Senate history.
“The Chinese immigration to the US wasn’t smooth and subjected to just about the same discriminations all minority groups suffered. But there are few Chinese Americans talking about these.”
Pre-WW2, all immigrant groups were treated like crap, often by other immigrant groups as much as by anglo-saxon Americans who touted their Mayflower heritage. At least chinese immigrants didn’t have get off the boat and into the draft line to fight the US civil war, spanish american war or WW1.

The problem with statements like “Our country has no racial discrimination” is that usually they come from people/institutions who are discriminating. Discrimination is an inalianable (albeit unfortunate) part of being human, and denying its existense provides the perfect breeding ground for it to continue. Look at the US for example. Our country was created on the premise that “All men are created equal.” This was of course in an environment where slavory was legal, women couldn’t vote, and the Indians were being systematically exterminated.

Ben –
I was 100% with you until you said “All men are created equal.” If you are saying that statement has somehow contributed to racism in the US, I will say you are completely wrong. That statement is an amazing statement and it is amazing because it is a statement both of truth for the way things were when made and for the aspirations of this country.
When made, all men were created equal. It says “created equal,” not treated equal. And by saying it at all, it is saying that the laws need to be changed to reflect this and that is exactly what eventually happened. I love (yes that is the right word) the U.S. Constitution and I probably love that sentence most of all.

I haven’t finished reading all the comments on this thread, but I see a lot of attempts in saying “Racism isn’t that bad in China.” Allow me to enlighten you. I am a Caucasian American, On august 31st, 2006 I went into the public security bureau at An Ding Men in Beijing (Beijing An Ding Men Gong An Ju) to renew my visa, which was expired. Either because it was expired for more than a month or because someone in the Gonganju wanted to make some extra money, they arrested me and placed me in the Beijing West Detention Center for 27 days (until August 26th.) I was never charged with a crime, or even accused of one, I offered up front to pay the maximum fine for an expired visa (5000 RMB) but, after they detained me they started asking my girlfriend (also American) for 30000. This however is all irrelevant for the topic.
I was one of two caucasians in the beijing ji liu suo, every other person in the prison was African or Middle-Eastern. All of these people were arrested for similar reasons – expired visas. None, except for myself, was allowed to see or speak to their embassy during the 27 days I was there. When I was detained, I was given a piece of paper which said I would not be held more than 30 days (I’ve come to find out that this is actually in violation of their own law, it should only be 10 days for an expired visa pending a criminal investigation, which they got around by saying ‘we think he’s committed a crime’ but never charged or accused me of.) None of the other inmates received this paper. In fact, there were some Kashmir refugees who I did not meet until two days before I left who had their UN Refugee papers confiscated and destroyed by the Gonganju when they arrived in Beijing. They had been detained for several months by the time I arrived. The Africans and Middle-Easterners were all treated worse than I was during my detainment. I was allowed out of my cell more often (which I shared with 8 other people,) the Doctor checked up on my health, and I was given more food (as inedible as it was) than the other detainees, which I gladly shared with them. (I ended up losing about 12 lbs during this ordeal.) If the other inmates were insubordinate they would be beaten. It would never happen in the cells as there are cameras to document everything. Instead, they would be taken to the adjacent ‘solitary’ wing and beaten, which everyone could here.
Since I have left, I have been attempting to contact the governments of some of these individuals that i befriended, the UN and Amnesty international. The latter being the only responsive party as of yet.
My point is this: Racism in China is systemic. And is indeed government sponsored (Anti-Japanese TV programs about wwII for example, as all media is state run in China.)
For those who debate it, read my story. For those who doubt it – feel free to check with Congressmen Dennis Moore (Kansas), Grassley (Iowa) or the American Embassy in Beijing.
Peace

Nick Tallmon –
That is an incredible story and I thank you for posting on it. Obviously a lesson to everyone not to leave China before the visa expires.
But was your treatment due to race or to politics/power?

Very interesting topic. Well I am an African, living in China for the last eight years, coming here first as student. To be brief, I would call anyone saying there is no racism in this country a moron. Us blacks are associated with ugliness, poverty and stupidity (by that I mean, lacking intellectual capabilities, sorry I am not a so-called “English native” :-) ).
There is also a lot of hypocrisy going around here, when they know you speak the language then whatever they said changes 360 degrees. But I had cases where I pretended not speaking the languages or them not knowing that I heard some comments I would not dare share on this nice blog.
Racism against Blacks is highly prevalent when it comes to jobs, visas (I have friends asked upfront by the police officers why they won’t just return to where they came from), relationships and more. But to be fair, there is also a great number of Chinese who are genuinely open minded and throughout my several years here I have been blessed to meet a couple of them. Also another thing I have noticed when you are well off the racism is not that obvious so sometimes I think the racism is mostly in the terms of: you are poor, I can’t get anything from you, why should I bother…
Finally, if the admin will allow, I would like to share my link http://www.afroshanghai.com, a site I created for Blacks living in China with another African friend of mine. If you want to have more insight on what is the real life of Blacks in China browse the forums.
And yes, Julia, if you have some questions, I will be glad to help for your paper which is much needed, you can also post a topic in the forums :-)
Best wishes to all of ya,
Pat in Shanghai

Julia –
Do you need permission?

Yes, China has no discrimination against minorities. No minorities in any other country other than China enjoys so many privileges. The only people subject to discrimination is the majority Han.

Anon –
Well then all China need do is end its discrimination against the Han and it will have achieved the status of the first truly and fully enlightened nation and people in history.