China Law Blog

I agree with the Australian article having taught in a Chinese university in Dalian and my girlfriend is a graduate of both Beijing University and Qinghua University (although she wasn't an engineering major). What I've seen and heard are that it's extremely difficult to get into universities in China but when they do get in, they just coast their way through to graduation. Graduate students who do research/work for professors/researchers are routinely abused and their work usually goes unpaid, even though the grants that the professors/researchers received from the government should be going to paying these grad students.

The main reason my gf hasn't gone on to do a PhD is because of the focus on money and profit in Chinese universities and not on research. It's a shame when people who are obviously bright and ambitious drop out of school because of the conditions at the 'top' schools.

I haven't even mentioned the amount of academic dishonesty in all schools at every level in China..that's another issue for another day.

Dezza --

Thanks for checking in and providing your near insider comments. I have heard that the number of university slots will actually be decreasing next year because of the large numbef of this year's graduates who have been unable to find good jobs. You are right that the rampant cheating that goes on in Chinese academia is a whole 'nother issue.

I am currently having my exchange student life in Tsinghua University. The article which says about the systematic problems appear in China University is indeed quite true in some extent. The lecturers here are obsessed with outside attachment and consulting works with commercial companies where they could get more money than the salaries given by their respective faculty. As a result, lecturers here spend more time in collaborating with them and have no enough to prepare for their classes. And of cos, they are distracted away from their researches and academics. I suggest the school should pay their local co-workers more instead of paying hundred thousands per year for those foreign lecturers which only show up 3-4 months a year.

Flash --

Thanks for checking in.

It is great to get such an inside perspective. I would also love to hear from someone defending the Chinese education system.

My 8 year old daughter is pen pals with the 8 year old daughter of a good friend of mine who is a lawyer in Dalian. Early in their correspondence the Chinese girl sent her most recent report card. What my wife (who is an elementary school psychologist) and I found so interesting was how much of it was devoted to compliments or criticisms regarding her ability to stay quiet and to conform to the group. This seemed to be at least as important as the academics.

"being obsessed with the production of meaningless research papers, rather than focusing on practical training, ..."---true. Yet in economic feild, which I majored in college, they are doing the opposite. Emphasis too much on technical training rather than on doing research. China;s education is always in a misplaced dilemma

I couldnt agree more with the above article as an educator currently living and working in one of China's so called developed areas - (Guilin) I have seen what I would like to call the smarter of my students fall behind simply because they are singled out due to the "rote" system that is in place at the University that I currently teach at.
These students are not only left behind they are singled out as "too revolutionary" both the students themselves (endemic within the system) and also by the "Party" committe within the School. If this type of 'failess' education is allowed to continue China will not only be "left behind" it will simply self destruct - The economic consequences of which, will of course be felt across the globe - The system as it stands now is not only producing a generation of "party" line robots it is creating a time bomb..

Mark --

Thanks for checking in. As you know, I am a big fan of your blog.

And yet, the Western media mindlessly continues to churn out statistics on the number of Chinese college graduates as though quantity trumps quality. My views on China's education are not as dire as yours, but I suspect that is only becuase I take comfort in the fact that education is not as important as educators (my father was a college professor) make it out to be. The greats in any field, (be it art, literature, engineering, business) so often become great not because of their education, but in spite of it. I say this not to minimize in any way the ill effects likely to be caused by China's poor education system, but to point out that it is, fortunately, not controlling.

Chinese education crushed creativity due to large numbers of students in the primary years. Most Chinese elementary schools have about 60 students for every teacher. How can you teach creativity in that environment? This is why drill and repetition is so popular. That style of learning becomes imprinted into the student and most of them finish their academic career not thinkng but memorizing.

Want to throw a Chinese student for a loop? Don't ask them when or what, ask them why.

Dave --

Thanks for checking in. Your point about class size is a good one, but I have to think it goes beyond that.

I love your "why" question.

I am always telling the younger lawyers in my office that asking the client "why" is the most important thing they can do. So often a client will tell us it wants to do X, when in reality it only thinks it wants to do X because it believes doing X is the only way for it to achieve its goal of Y. By our asking "why do you want to do X," we can learn that X is just a perceived stepping stone towards Y and we can then discuss how Y might be better achieved by doing A, B or C.

I think dave and Dezza said it all.

Many of my students actually enjoyed learning how to respond to "why" questions this year. In restrospect, I may have done more harm than good by facilitating some of the change. They have little or no opportunities avalable to them upon graduation. This is especialy because they went to a school much, much lower in the food chain than any you mentioned.

Dave has an interesting perspective on what is to come at:

Greetings from the South...

Lonnie (OMB)--

Thanks for checking in. I have seen your lesson plans on the web, including the one where you posted a Chinese classified ad (I cannot remember whether it was for a job, an apartment or a roommate and your classroom blog no longer seems to be up on the internet) making very clear that no Blacks need apply and you asked the students whether this was racist. I have to believe forcing people to think about questions like this does more good than harm.

Also, if the Chinese students are going to be engaging in actions you predict by referring us to Dave in China's post, I for one prefer that these students have thought about the many big issues you threw at them.